Secure .gov websites use HTTPS I'd like to know more about the outcome. Sometimes its not possible to accommodate requests, either because of airport or supervisory/FAA edicts or because of systemic procedures or because of current workload. Pilot deviation is a serious mistake to make when you are piloting a plane, and the consequences could be disastrous. The other pilot had it right - he's a real a*&^. Harrison Ford is an accomplished pilot that made the same sort of mistake that many Commercial ATP pilots have made setting up for the wrong runway or taxiway etc. This guy should be banned from flying period! If the worst were to happen, people could lose their lives due to pilot deviation, which is not something that anyone wants to have on their conscience. Researching this pilot's flight with FlightAware and Flightradar24 a much clearer picture emerges. 2020-007191WS Anonymous (Laing) Invoice.pdf, 2020-007191WS Anonymous (Laing) PDPNR.pdf, Subject: RE: Freedom of Information Act Request #2020-007191. As a pilot, pilot deviation is something that you should avoid at all costs when possible, but what does it mean? Is there any way you can vector me through? Double that. Due to the multiple violations including multiple times refusing to obey an ATC order, I am hoping the pilot's license is suspended at a minimum. [His lack of permission and knowledge about needing such was discussed by previous posters and is referenced here just for completeness.]. I hope this guy is ready to hear a lot of "unable VFR services" or "radar services terminated, squawk VFR, frequency change approved" when they recognize who he is again. https://www.reddit.com/r/flying/comments/a1wehj/so_who_has_one_of_these/ Undiagnosed tumors and the like can lead to emotional regulation problems and impaired judgement. Heres the full ATC audio, should you want to listen to it (when you listen to it youll appreciate just how angry this guys tone is): Ive never heard ATC audio where a pilot is so disobedient to instructions. He should have declared an emergency when denied entry into Bravo. Most were very professional and cooperative but there are always the few that made things difficult. ATC Audio: Negligent Pilot Argues With Air Traffic Controller, I love listening to air traffic control audio, Not Good: Boom Overture Left Without Engines, Factorydesigns Innovative New Narrow Body Business Class Seat, Please view our advertising policy page for additional details about our partners. I'd very much like to know. The Registry will be issuing revised certificates in batches based on the former expiration date. The pilot of N731NR is a jerk, as well as an unsafe pilot that should not be flying. Continuing into class Bravo airspace without a clearance and then flying right thru the active ILS approach to a major airport is a huge problem. and I think you are either that rude pilot or his wife. 07-Oct-2022. We will also go into the consequences that could occur if you were to get into trouble for this. Even if you dont have a good understanding of ATC terminology, the situation should be easy enough to make sense of. Now, I hate to defend this guy because what he did was insane but i'm not so quick to pull his ticket simply because I wouldn't want my Now, I hate to defend this guy because what he did was insane but i'm not so quick to pull his ticket simply because I wouldn't want my ticket pulled if I messed up - though I wouldn't like that. This isnt a slap on the wrist type of offense. PS: The trauma was from being hit with luggage that fell out of the overhead upon disembarking. Don't argue with these pros. Anyone flying under VFR (Visual . Indeed: N731NR - Aircraft Registration Information D DankVectorz Legendary Member FAA Messages 1,895 Facility N90 New York Tracon Jun 25, 2020 #6 Phillyman2633 said: What the cuck? She was far better to him than a lot of NY approach controllers are to good pilots on a good day (and I like NY approach, by the way). He did request a clearance. - attitude, attitude, attitude, and I'm not talking about the aircraft. The few concerns about behavior affected by incipient tumor or hypoxia bring back memories. Hundreds could have died. I live in Las Vegas. "N731NR (still whining): "Then clear me through. It's not just the danger of him putting his plane where he shouldn't have been--there is the addition of the energy spent dealing with him (multiple radio calls taking time away from other tasks, plus building frustration--controllers are human too, and this stuff can really foul your day). I fly in the busy Chicago airspace as a private pilot and the vast majority of Private pilots are as professional as the air transport pilots, and are often much less complacent in and around the class B and class C airspace. They got a full 2/3 of their pilots certificated!! The duration of aircraft registration certificates has been extended up to 7 years. Did anyone ever find out what happened to this pilot? We will leave some of the most common violations below for you to read about. It will get figured out. My reliable bet is that sometime between approach switching the aircraft to tower and the time the phone number is read, the pilot gave the tower controller a sob story. Hundreds could have died. I'm the ATC supervisor in FSD is NxxxxR still Gotta love how times have changed She then states (in so many words) that she didn't clear him and she's the only one that can clear him. That kind of thing happens every day. These guys & women keep 10-20 balls in the air constantly..you think you can do better?? People get frustrated in the air just like they do in cars and dont get their license suspended. I think by "Airforce" [sic] you're thinking of all those movies you've seen. To all the negative comments we did not hear previous communication. Just like the American pilots did when they couldn't get runway 31 at JFK. It was quite a [emailprotected]## show. a responsibility to operate safely and competently within the FARs regardless of the price of your plane. He's a danger to us all and I don't want to share the sky with him. It would be one thing if he "unintentionally" violated the Class B airspace (how exactly do you do that in this day and age?). B734. Of course that is true, but people who are suffering recent onset of dementia / tumor-induced emotional outbursts / schizophrenia etc. Everything is on tape. https://cdn.muckrock.com/foia_files/2020/09/15/FLM1_Phone_Call_N731NR_-_Redacted.wav. Wrong. I hope he stops making bad decisions before he no longer has the ability to do so. "N731NR (angrily): "I'm not ready to copy. saturn in ardra nakshatra pada 2 n731nr pilot deviation. Please provide this information by COB, on Friday July 17, 2020, or we will go with the last known requestor from MuckRock.com, who we are showing as Matthew Phelan. For those that don't want to read. At the end, it seems like there was at least one transmission we didn't hear where this pilot was giving "his side of the story" to Henderson Ground, hence that controller apologizing to him. He never said he was unable to exit the Bravo due to terrain like he told the supervisor. Part of the perfected status is a complete name, and address from each requestor. This guy is a class-one "all about me" narcissist who makes GA pilots look bad. Subject: FOIA 2020-007191WP DUE: 8/6/2020, 411A Highland AvenueSomerville, MA 02144-2516, Subject: Freedom of Information Act (FOIA) Request 2020-007191WP. Reminds me of center frequencies ignoring calls from VFR aircraft. If you do receive a brasher warning, you should know that you do not have to call the provided telephone straight away, and you are allowed to take some time to think about the situation that has occurred. I was really busy at the time and he took up much of my time and reduced the safe operation of the airspace. If you have any questions or concerns, please contact the coordinator(s) found in the letter. 866.835.5322 (866-TELL-FAA)Contact Us, United States Department of Transportation, Aviation Safety Draft Documents Open for Comment, Airport Coronavirus Response Grant Program, Legislation & Policies, Regulations & Guidance, Certificated Remote Pilots including Commercial Operators, Recreational Flyers & Modeler Community-Based Organizations, Archived Quarterly Enforcement Reports (These reports date back to the first quarter of 1997. 3 This pilot is more than likely going to have to do recurrent training probably 10 to 15 hrs before privalages can be restored. The call taker should stick to the facts and avoid all emotionality, etc. This guy make me sick!!! Sincerely,Annjanette CumminsNational FOIA Coordinator for ANM, AAL & AWP RegionsFOIA Program Management Branch, AFN-400(206) 231-2034[AFN3_SignatureImage_2a]. What would the discussion be today if there had been a midair collision like the one in San Diego in 1979 with the PSA 727 and a Cessna? Interceptions are dangerous and that jet blast and thrust from either twin thrust (F-15) or single thrust (F-16) could put the Cessna into a dangerous condition. About 45 minutes after the student left my phone rings I was the 16yo kid working the desk when his #2 instructor sent a private student off on his long cross country and controlled airspace solo flight he went to lunch. While working on my instrument rating and flying in and out of Midway airport I heard dozens of Southwest pilots being human, and missing instructions, blowing through airspeed restrictions, among other FAR violations and getting dressed down by ATC when they goofed up. Runway 27L, cleared for takeoff." You respond appropriately. Once I had to reroute a general aviation pilot around weather to miss other traffic and he would not do it, Finally I was told to Once I had to reroute a general aviation pilot around weather to miss other traffic and he would not do it, Finally I was told to ask him "are you refusing an air traffic control clearance?" Even the big airline pilots (American, Delta, etc.) Dad got home that night after his charter. Caller - is he available, Unless it has been authorized by the ATC, no pilot should operate an aircraft according to any clearance or instruction that has been issued to the pilot of another aircraft. Really when you hit "submit" you should have not. The aircraft, N731NR, is registered to "Wife Approved LLC." I remember many times that pilots would argue with me about instructions. The controller states that the pilot needs clearance to be in Bravo and to have requested clearance. Your participation in helping us identify both our strong and weak points will help us improve our service(s) to all our stakeholders. Visit a tracon JUST ONCE. Your request is assigned to the office listed below: Federal Aviation Administration Contact: Amelia McGillWestern-Pacific Region (424) 405-7221Flight Standards Division, AWP-200777 S. Aviation Blvd.El Segundo, CA 90245. I was working the ER In Jerusalem and this belligerent teen was being kept there for observation post head trauma. It appears that this pilot is a child of the "Magenta Line", it looks like he flies with automation on a lot. Looks like we found the co-owner of Wife Approved, LLC. I didn't hear anything that I didn't find out of line. Anyone flying under VFR (Visual Flight Rules) needs to hear the words You are cleared to enter the Bravo airspace before entering the Bravo airspace. I'm flying.". You have successfully joined our subscriber list. I, at times, if the weather is good enough, cancelled IFR..continuing on my own. I look forward to receiving your response to this request within 20 business days, as the statute requires. OR he's actually the A that pilot b called him and in that case, break out the cheese grater and throw the AH over your knee. Result - IP and my Mom who normally ran the business in Dads absence got back at the same time. (i.e. I suspect the way this will be (or has been) settled is that both the controller and the pilot will be counseled respectively on what they could have done to prevent the situation. Get the stick out of your asses. A pilot will be given priority in an emergency situation, and they will need to submit a report of this emergency within 48 hours to the manager of the ATC facility if this is requested of them. The Cessna P210N stall speed is 67 knots. Maybe, just maybe this controller was playing her Bravo authority a little too far? This guys ego trip does not trump the lives of the flying public and those on the ground who live under the pattern. Although VASAviation transcribed it as "you're being that," it sounded to me more like this pilot started to retort with, "YOU'RE being an ass--", then caught himself and said, "That is not appropriate language.". I drove IP the 95 miles to FSD and he had a session with the controller and the supervisor. That's the whole point of talking to you.". airworthiness of an aircraft or the current aircraft configuration. ATC: "N1NR, possible pilot deviation, advise to contact Las Vegas approach. Shout out to Capt. ATC either turns him around or gives him a better heading. I'm very impressed that he could do all that. For the bloviating piehole who made a comment about the American pilot who required 31L, I was the PIC and I declared an emergency three times because there was one. The overall outcome will depend on the situation in question and the consequences of the incident. All the information we have at this point shows that he blamed ATC for . People get frustrated in the air just like they do in cars and dont get their license suspended. Is there an issue? My father was an Air Traffic Controller when the accident happened over San Diego in 1979 (not the one on duty when the accident occurred) so I know just as much about the history of this airspace as you claim to know, maybe even more. Any request must be met with an instruction and then a confirmation. In over 30 years of flying, I have sat and listened to amateur pilots give ATC professionals a load of sh*#. They also rechecked the examiner who tested him on his private he got suspended for a short time and had to recheck as a examiner. I know what he did was wrong but I understand his frustration. It causes paperwork (at the very least) on both sides and is also distracting from other important duties. Thank you, number as soon as IP returns will have him call. There was a similar incident once about 10 years ago in New York where the kid would keep declaring and undeclaring an emergency. Learn more. I don't care where people get frustrated. While we do try to list all the best miles and points deals, the site does not include all card companies or credit card offers available in the marketplace. Not for nothing, but shes only got 2 guys in the area, coulda cleared him through. You should be ashamed. Neil Wilsonthe CFIIsays "maybe the controller was playing her class BRAVO authority a little too far".. You should not be a CFII with that kind of attitude. This is about aviation. All I do is shake my head and smile. N731NR (still whining): "I've asked for clearance multiple times. 05:29PM CDT Abel Santa Maria - SNU. He was wrong in what he did but I had to voice this opinion. He had to pass my father's exam before IP could sign off on him. In this case, a plane with the registration code N1NR enters Bravo airspace without clearance to do so, and thats where the situation starts: ATC: N1NR, I need you outside of the Bravo.Pilot: Negative.ATC: Negative what?Pilot: Im inside.ATC: You were not given a clearance through the Bravo. I love listening to air traffic control audio, either just live, or recordings of interesting interactions. She kept phoning her father, a MD in LA and complaining about her mistreatment and threatening everybody with lawsuits. Only then did he comply with instructions. Let the appropriate agency (the FAA) handle this. A lock ( LockA locked padlock ) or https:// means youve safely connected to the .gov website. People get frustrated in the air just like they do in cars and dont get their license suspended. See more about our ethics policies here. For this pilot (tail number N731NR abbreviated to N1NR), it wasn't a mistake as noted by the following exchange: LAS Approach: "N1NR, I need you outside of the Bravo"N731NR: "Negative"LAS: "Negative what? Reddit and its partners use cookies and similar technologies to provide you with a better experience. @Coinneach - Im fully aware of their rights, and I do not have to agree with it. "Those who deny freedom to others deserve it not forthemselves, and under a just God, cannot long retain it. The requested documents will be made available to the general public, and this request is not being made for commercial purposes. ATC is trying to direct traffic and Mr Wachner regardless of a possible misunderstanding says to hell with you I'm doing what I want. They don't take airspace incursions lightly, ESPECIALLY in the #8 most busy airport in the US. Advertiser Disclosure: Some links to credit cards and other products on this website will earn an affiliate commission. 2 Letter from FAA notifying an investigation is underway, privileges may be suspended or curtailed until investigation is over. It seems like the pilot was intent on entering Bravo with or without permission. She refuses and he petulantly retorts back. Avoiding Pilot Deviations.pdf (1016.81 KB) Pilot deviations can occur in several different ways. Maybe follow-up later with a phone call to make sure they knew it was entirely unintentional, you immediately corrected the error, and that safety is paramount. The tower controller likely For everyone making your amazing judgment calls on the Henderson controller: Other pilots chimed in calling him for what he was. Next morning he called student and flew with him back to FSD did 3 practice approaches with touch and go with the last being a full stop. @Wingslover said, "If youre having medical issues or youre feeling unwell youre not supposed to be in command of an aircraft.". Pilot: Ive asked for clearance multiple times.ATC: N1NR, I told you to remain outside the Bravo.ATC: N1NR, possible pilot deviation, advise to contact Las Vegas approach.

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